czwartek, 7 października 2010

Na tureckim zakręcie

Po bardzo długiej przerwie… bardzo osobista notka.
A w niej równie osobista, subiektywna oraz niepoprawna politycznie (choć mocno ocenzurowana), spisana na kolanie lista.

Natchnięta podobną listą zrobioną przez znajomą, publikuję własne plusy i minusy Stambułu, czyli dzikiego (choć już znanego, więc prawie okiełznanego) Wschodu…


... plusy:

- mało wymagająca, nieźle płatna praca. oczywiście… TYLKO (lub AŻ - w zależności od upodobań) angielski
- Bosfor, morze, promy… woda!!! blisko do Grecji, Bułgarii..
- klimat, pogoda… słońce! palmy!
- Kadıköy, Moda, Kalamış
- znajomi z Kadıköy.. mieszkanie na Modzie.. jachty w Kalamış
- bezpieczny stan zawieszenia, nieuzasadnione poczucie relaksu
- azjatycka egzotyka
- nieliczne zalety (ale jednak jakieś tam zalety) bycia yabancı (czyli cudzoziemcem)


... i mniej istotne (choć liczne) minusy:

- kontrola społeczna
- tureccy mężczyźni ( :) )
- Turczynki... nie bardzo!!! (szczególnie na wyższym poziomie przyjacielskiego wtajemniczenia)
- nie nauczę się nigdy tego dziwacznego języka na poziomie, na jakim bym chciała!
- wszyscy fajni ludzie, których znam i lubię, prędzej czy później stąd wyjadą
- tłumyyyyyy! poszturchiwania, przepychanki, deptanie po nogach (patrz punkt trzeci)
- bycie yabancı na zawsze („where are you from?”, “did you see Sultanahmet?”, “do you like Turkey?”)
- trzęsienie ziemi (WSZYSTKO się zawali!!!)
- zasiedziałam się i rozleniwiłam -> Stambuł wciąga i wysysa jak wampir energetyczny
- nielegalna praca.. brak emerytury.. brak składek.. wizyty na wydziale policji dla cudzoziemców na Aksaray -> never ever again!!!
- korki, cholerni kierowcy -> śmierć czyha na każdej uliczce, w każdym dolmuşu, na każdym kroku
- brak szacunku dla jednostki, wszechobecny kısmet i kader (przeznaczenie), brak logicznego myślenia, planowania, irytująca postawa „jakoś to będzie”
- „Burası Türkiye”……



Chaotyczna lista spisana w Şile, na samotnym, jednodniowym wypadzie nad Morze Czarne, którego nie widziałam (wstyd…) już prawie cztery lata.

Şile okazało się niestety gwoździem do tureckiej trumny. Lokalna społeczność zdemoralizowana przez stambulskich turystów. Gapienie się, cmokanie – gorzej niż w Trabzonie i Konyi razem wziętych. Trąbienie i pogłaśnianie muzyki w samochodzie na widok spacerującej samotnie yabancı.
Małe piwo w cenie dużego (proszę o ellilik, czyli 0,5, dostaję 0,33).
Naprawdę, nie tego się spodziewałam po „słynnym Şile”, dumie lokalnej turystyki...

Widoki co prawda niczego sobie.
Turkusowe morze. Wzburzone fale. Zatoczki z malowniczymi jaskiniami. Okoliczne plaże są w końcu znane i kochane z jakiegoś powodu.

Ale centrum? Polecam wybrać się jednak do pobliskiej miejscowości zwanej Ağva, która (podobno) nie zostawia nikogo obojętnym.

A jak jest w Şile, proponuję ocenić samemu:









26 komentarzy:

Gastria pisze...

Hejjjj, jednak ten blog żyje, jak dobrze!!!

Odnośnie Twego wpisu:

"- nie nauczę się nigdy tego dziwacznego języka na poziomie, na jakim bym chciała!"

Nie przerażaj mnie...myślałam, że ktoś doświadczony jak Ty już dawno śmiga w tym zawiłym języku płynnie. Moja znajomość na chwilę obecną to pojedyncze słówka i zdania czyli ok 3 letnie dziecko ze mnie...ehh mam te same obawy, że się nie nauczę :/ a bez tureckiego pracy tutaj yok.

"- bycie yabancı na zawsze („where are you from?”, “did you see Sultanahmet?”, “do you like Turkey?”)"

Mam dokładnie to samo, z tymże za miast Turkey pytają się o Cyprus. Jeszcze jest pytanie " Do you like here? " co mnie totalnie wkurza, bo gdybym nie lubiła to chyba by mnie tu nie było? Więc po co to przygłupawe pytanie? No i pytanie notoryczne: "Are you from Russia?", no kurcze czy mam wypisane Russia na czole? Nastepnym razem odpowiem "No, Im from Mars"...:P

Blog świetny. Pozdrawiam z KKTC! :)

little_miss_bossy pisze...

Ojj... nostalgia mnie ogarnela...

Duzo prawdy w tym co piszesz jest, pisze z doswiadczenia :)

Ciekawa jestem, gdzie sie teraz spotkamy?

iyi şanslar ve görüşmek uzere inşallah :)

aga pisze...

modowi znajomi tesknia kochana!!!!

a.

mahnov pisze...

yea right..

you spent 4 years in turkey and istanbul - are all of the items you mentioned in your blog constituting the results that you arrived? these are false generalizationss - implying poor education and improper civilized behavior, too. how you dare to say that the "minus" in istanbul is "turcznyka", themselves? this is hugely offensive, lots of people helped you here..

it seems you came to country and were not able to penetrate the culture at all.. first of all, what you don't see, istanbul is not turkish. in fact, %90 percent of the population here in turkey are not ethically turkish so they don't designate a reasonable foundation upon which you might build a meaningful social analysis.. and secondly, intricately connected with the 1st one, the historical nation state practices in turkey should always be taken into account when pondering about this weird country..

i might also suggest you to read this: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2007/oct/23/comment.turkey

your previous blogs are also flawed, too. you seemingly did not understand the islamic concept of kader.. you should not mix turkic values, which might manifest themselves in the form of music, short stories, jokes, etc. with the islamic values as they usually are contradictory, their tense state of relation requires much more attention..

Anonimowy pisze...

Hey Gokhan!go screw yourself!

mahnov pisze...

thnx anonimowy for intellectual input and broadening the discussion. during the process of screwing myself you might be interested in making some readings, which is gonna be probably so difficult for you, as it would clear the way for prejudgments fixed in your mindset and leave no room for swearing. i might suggest great polish marxist zygmunt bauman's "life in fragments / essays in postmodern morality", especially the chapters around "being an alien" or "living with strangers"..

ana z maroka pisze...

Widoczek na pierwszym zdjęciu wart wizyty w tej miejscowości!

Do mahnov: Bauman ma dobre książki a prawo do krytyki ma każdy. Nie odbiejaj go więc również autorce tego bloga. Miłość do Turcji lub jakiegokolwiek innego kraju to nie PRZYMUS lub OBOWIĄZEK. To tak jak w życiu, miłość przychodzi lub jej wcale nie ma..
Pozdrawiam :)

mahnov pisze...
Ten komentarz został usunięty przez autora.
mahnov pisze...

Thnx Ana for this valuable response. However, I am not talking spesifically about emotions, my objection was mainly against the methodological interpretation. I, as a Turkish subject, also don't fancy the country too much at some levels, especially governmentally and politically and frequently leaving it for abroad. Also the country and its individuals who are living on the physical surface of it, are not the same. You can say "I don't like Turkey", I might understand that, you might imply climate, food whatever.. I don't like Poland, in this manner, too, I lived there nearly for a year, did not like the climate (dislike UK&RUssia too, beacuse of that), the Church domination in social affairs etc etc.. HOwever, would any kind of bad impression that I had about a country, give me right to say, even to write in my blog publicly "what is negative in Warsaw is the Poles?" This is cultural discrimination, even racism. I am sorry.. And it is a fault that should never ever be made by a social scientist, as, national differences are so lame and vague, as the nations themselves are the bourgoise fiction of 18-19th centuries..

Having looked all the content, I am indeed insisting on the fact that the author of this blog, did not penetrate the local culture at all after 4 long years -probably did not want to, because of the prejudgments, or of some nasty experiences?- even managed to ignore some colossally huge names, like Nazim Hikmet, who is an internationally renowned Turkish poet, died in Russia as a POLISH citizen, as he's got paternal roots in Polish jewry.. So, things are more complicated down here than one might imagine, reminding us the fact that one should take extra-caution when looking at it. Especially, for Istanbul, every generalization is destined to be drowned in the cold waters of Bosphorus.

I am also attaching a link showing different genetical ancestral outlook for Turkish people.. http://www.assyrianfoundation.org/genetics.htm

So that was my point.. Teşekkür ederim for the conversation..

Gastria pisze...

Mahnov - I think you misunderstood the author. Except minuses of living in Turkey she wrote about pluses too. It seems you didn't see it, and you've focused only on the "bad side" of her words. I personally didn't find them too offensive.
I live for over an year in KKTC - its not Turkey I know - but I could also wrote advantages and disadvantages of living here (as author did according to Turkey). In every country we wont find 100% things which we will like. I'm polish and I don't like Poland for many reasons, and I'm not afraid to say that. I know Turkish people like to praise their country so much in many subjects - its good, but not everyone who lives there MUST do it also. As the author of her own blog she has rights to say what she likes and what not that's one of the blogs rules. Turkey is not ideal, Poland is not ideal and other countries too.
You are writing about false generalizations, nasty experience, improper behavior, mixing values...etc. The question is: weren't you doing/aren't you doing same after living for ONLY 1 yearn i Poland? You said here you didn't like this country because of cold etc (isn't that some kind of generalization too?)Please, don't be so "saint".
Another question is: Why she wrote all those words? Maybe it wasn't 100% her fault that she didn't like several things in Turkey? Maybe bad attitude, or wrong issues that happened during her 4 years staying in Turkey made her to think like this? Maybe people whom she met made her to think like that? And so what that many people helped here there - should she love everyone for it, just because she is in Turkey? Reading your somehow offensive post, Ive observed big nationalism and close-mind thinking. Sorry to say that, but since you have rights to criticize her post and her, I can do same about you...Regards :)

mahnov pisze...

Gastria - I think "you" deliberately misunderstood me. I clearly stated that fact in my note. I said "YOU CAN say "I don't like Turkey", I might understand that, you might imply climate, food whatever.."

and I added.. "the country and its individuals who are living on the physical surface of it, are not THE SAME." Right?

One came Istanbul and didn't like Turks, hell yea.. And one sees no problem in publicly expressing it.. What about Kurds, Armenians, Jews.. YOu know what, Istanbul is the BIGGEST Kurdish city in the world, what about them, then?

What about Jewish Turks? Then are you not becoming an anti-semite when generalizing?

Let's imagine, YOu visit Israel, Tel Aviv, spent there 4 years and making a list like this:

plus:
-humus
-falafel
-night life, sea
-etc..
-..

minus:
-military culture
-jewish men & women
-hot climate
-..

then you gonna have a good lesson from our Jewish fellows that food and climate and human beings are not the same. 6 years of sociology education should provide more abstractive capabilities than that. Try to make a list like that, as a Polish citizen, while you are staying THERE.. You even cannot expect consequences. (Not immediately after leaving the country! As with the case here:)

And I AGAIN mentioned about "nasty experiences" in my note. Nasty experiences, of course, would lead a person to make generalizations, however personal frustrations cannot be reflected at all levels. If you are in wrong circles, then you arrive wrong destinations. Also, there is a significant possibility that, because of this elitist, exclusivist (which, in turn, does not have any ground..) attitude, any person would experience nasty social interactions everywhere in the world.

I reject your criticism about my being nationalist, as it is totally groundless. I am an antimilitarist, have been put on trial several times because of that in Turkey, and been subject of European-wide campaigns. (and what kind of chauvinist would refer to communists like Bauman, Zizek, Hikmet.. I wonder..) I am not defending any nation, nor promoting. If I talk very SUBJECTIVELY, I am observing middle-class bigotry and right-wing liberal values are taking huge steps in ex-soviet bloc countries and I am seeing traces of this phenomenon in your(s) line of argumentation.
And lastly: You say: "I know Turkish people like to praise their country so much in many subjects" LOL.. I say people should avoid making generalizations - if they wanna stay civilized, you provide another one. Please come to Istanbul one day and I'll show you entirely different view..

Friendly..

mahnov pisze...

http://theturkishlife.blogspot.com/
http://istanbuls-stranger.blogspot.com/

i'd suggest these blogs, too..

Gastria pisze...

Mahnov I understand now your frustration...Ive been in Istanbul only once,however Im planing to visit it again. I found it as a great city, multicultural one and very tolerant, but as I say: its first time so Im sure I need to come again to know it better :) Thx for links I will take a look for sure :)Regards.

Gastria pisze...

"What about Kurds, Armenians, Jews.. YOu know what, Istanbul is the BIGGEST Kurdish city in the world, what about them, then?

What about Jewish Turks? Then are you not becoming an anti-semite when generalizing?"

aha and by the way I dont have anything against kurdish, turkish, jewish russian or any other kind of people. Im very tolerant but seems u are not...(?)

mahnov pisze...
Ten komentarz został usunięty przez autora.
Anonimowy pisze...

I would like to know, how Mahnov managed to understand Polish language constructed in a manner that not only requires fluent knowledge of the lunguage, but also ability to read between the lines and analytic skills. Just curious.

Anonimowy pisze...

By the way, it seems that you were able only some of the expressions into google transaltor, so let me help you: Po bardzo długiej przerwie… bardzo osobista notka.
A w niej równie osobista, subiektywna oraz niepoprawna politycznie (choć mocno ocenzurowana), spisana na kolanie lista.
Agata wrote at the beginning of this controversial entry that: this is very personal, subjective and politically inappropriate note(...)so where is the freedom of speech?

mahnov pisze...
Ten komentarz został usunięty przez autora.
mahnov pisze...

hey Anonimowy, i got Polish friends, ok? Don't worry about translation..

AS I told before, visit Tel Aviv one day and try to make a similar "very subjective" list about Jews..

If it comes to SOCIETY, the author of this blog, cannot be subjective, quite the reverse, she should be OBJECTIVE as she is a social scientist, sociologist, with a masters degree. But seemingly, she has no professional integrity, at all.

Also what kind of human rights activist, who came here with amnesty Int, can have blunt attitude towards to the society like that? I am curious on that, too..

Freedom of speech, of course she has it. But I have too! Also what I believe what can freely be circulated is the positive discrimination , not this sort of "minus", negative discrimination.. This is a public space, internet is not an empty void, could form opinions of the people..

mahnov pisze...
Ten komentarz został usunięty przez autora.
mahnov pisze...

Or just forget about my last message. It is none of my business to remind anyone's professional or ethical responsibilities.

It is already and incidentally acknowledged that the author has an, "subjectively" (as if it provides grounds for legitimization) exclusive logic about foreigners, which may curiously allow her to put whole race into the "minus" part of her list, which is published publicly in author's official blog.

Even that list was preCENSORED by her. wow. - Really wondered the unedited version!

Anyway no words really needed.. Let's expect future will bring more elastic cerebral pathways to some persons, on which their thoughts will flow like F1 cars without crashing into any oldskull limitations..

mahnov pisze...
Ten komentarz został usunięty przez autora.
Tomek pisze...

Zacznę od pochwały Twoich zdjęć, które są wspaniałe!

Jeśli chodzi o plusy i minusy Stambułu (dawnego Konstantynopola) to najbardziej przerażają mnie trzęsienia ziemi i brak szacunku dla jednostki. Myślę, że Europejczykom (a Polakom w szczególności) trudno jest mieszkać w mieście zdominowanym przez Islam. W Turcji panuje inna mentalność, inaczej się traktuje kobiety tak jak napisałaś zawsze się jest obcym.

Z drugiej strony chciałbym tam pojechać na wakacje i zrobić dużo zdjęć :)

Anonimowy pisze...

Hej tam,

co do Sile to niestety mam podobne zdanie, ciesz się że zamiast piwa nie zamówiłaś ryby, za taki kaprys mój biedny towarzysz musiał kiedyś zapłacić 110 lir... a bić się przecież z kelnerem i jego kumplami nie będziesz.

Ps. Bardzo dobry blog i wg mnie obiektywny;-).

Bedawi بدوي pisze...

Najbardziej podoba mi się pierwszy plus:)
Selamlar
dromaderka.blogspot.com

KlubTurysty pisze...

Ech, co poradzić na tych facetów, tak ich wychowują, takimi potem są. Ja bym się nie zdecydowała na mieszkanie w kraju Bliskiego Wschodu. Niby Turcja blisko Europy, bardziej w naszym kierunku, ale jednak...